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Thread: Avan Variant

  1. #201
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    3,429

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    Remind me people, the problem it causes to move the DRAW phase to the end of the turn.

  2. #202
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    Ive changed magic wall rules for this rule
    -"When a standard wall gets destroyed, all opponents of the controller of that wall place the top three cards of their discard pile on top of their magic piles"

    While magic walls were fun and balanced the game a lot, a few problems cropped up as result. The main one was that an early "good turn" could snowball to imminent Victory. This was a special problem for summoners with "fragile" setups.
    After tinkering a while i came up with this idea. It does help agression making walls "more expensive" and more rewarding to "wound" walls. now it's still valuable to attack walls, but most of the payoff comes later, highly reducing the "snowball effect".
    I'm pretty happy with the results in early testing. My main question is if 3 magic is enough or i should increase the effect to 4 magic. Or if in fact it's too much and i should tone it down to 2.

    I think it's thematic, so I feel good on that side.

    Some positive minor sideffects compared to old magic walls:
    - No more annoying dilemma "I don't want to attack this wall too fast, so i can get more magic out of it"
    - No more destroying your own wall to deny your opponent magic as it sometimes ended happening with magic walls
    - Significant rallul nerf, who likes to to sacrifice walls with etch and rallul ability.
    - Way less fear of placing offensive walls. With magic walls sometimes you didnt want to place a forward wall for fear it would be drained 2 or 3 magic, even during the offensive, sometimes working against the offensive player. Now you won't give any magic until you lose the wall, if you manage to lose the entire wall prolly your offensive has been stopped already.

    The only negative effect i could think off so far:
    This produce a significant undesirable buff to Besiege the walls. With old magic walls this wasnt a problem, but now killing walls with besiege the walls is really brutal, playing more than one wall at the same time vs Olding is close to suicidal now. I do generally not play 2 walls at the same time vs oldin anyway, but before it was common for olding to get one of your walls with double besiege, while before it was an interesting decision, now besiege the wall is a must play card.
    I find this however a really minor problem compared to hugely improving the fun of the game when oldin is not involved.
    Last edited by Waterd; 04-10-2018 at 08:38 AM.

  3. #203
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Fairfax, VA
    Posts
    520

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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterd View Post
    Remind me people, the problem it causes to move the DRAW phase to the end of the turn.
    Probably mostly versus effects like:
    -discarding e.g. Thief
    -stealing e.g. Mimic
    -start of turn/draw effects e.g. Jexik

    Otherwise it would be better at the end to reduce analysis time between turns.

  4. #204
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    2,853

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    The draw phase potential problems is why Jwalker and I have started playing:

    At end of turn, you may draw a number of cards from top of Draw Pile you would draw in next draw phase and then place the drawn cards back on top of your Draw Pile in the same order.

    The only part of this is it kind of requires truthfulness about something that’s not transparent in way that’s not required elsewhere in SW

  5. #205
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    1,379

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Waterd View Post
    Ive changed magic wall rules for this rule
    -"When a standard wall gets destroyed, all opponents of the controller of that wall place the top three cards of their discard pile on top of their magic piles"

    While magic walls were fun and balanced the game a lot, a few problems cropped up as result. The main one was that an early "good turn" could snowball to imminent Victory. This was a special problem for summoners with "fragile" setups.
    After tinkering a while i came up with this idea. It does help agression making walls "more expensive" and more rewarding to "wound" walls. now it's still valuable to attack walls, but most of the payoff comes later, highly reducing the "snowball effect".
    I'm pretty happy with the results in early testing. My main question is if 3 magic is enough or i should increase the effect to 4 magic. Or if in fact it's too much and i should tone it down to 2.

    I think it's thematic, so I feel good on that side.

    Some positive minor sideffects compared to old magic walls:
    - No more annoying dilemma "I don't want to attack this wall too fast, so i can get more magic out of it"
    - No more destroying your own wall to deny your opponent magic as it sometimes ended happening with magic walls
    - Significant rallul nerf, who likes to to sacrifice walls with etch and rallul ability.
    - Way less fear of placing offensive walls. With magic walls sometimes you didnt want to place a forward wall for fear it would be drained 2 or 3 magic, even during the offensive, sometimes working against the offensive player. Now you won't give any magic until you lose the wall, if you manage to lose the entire wall prolly your offensive has been stopped already.

    The only negative effect i could think off so far:
    This produce a significant undesirable buff to Besiege the walls. With old magic walls this wasnt a problem, but now killing walls with besiege the walls is really brutal, playing more than one wall at the same time vs Olding is close to suicidal now. I do generally not play 2 walls at the same time vs oldin anyway, but before it was common for olding to get one of your walls with double besiege, while before it was an interesting decision, now besiege the wall is a must play card.
    I find this however a really minor problem compared to hugely improving the fun of the game when oldin is not involved.
    also reactive effects that adds or remove cards from your hand (opponents spent magic and amoeba goes to discard -> your hand; runesmith; abolish; shadows; steal; spy and so on)

    We bascially play -> look can already look at the cards you would draw next turn but they remain on the draw pile.

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