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Thread: Beginner tips for beating RMs and Etch

  1. #31
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    I agree etch wasn't a factor. And My prediction is that he won't in our games. The way you play make etch pretty much useless or irrelevant. With that said I predict i will win 80%+ of our games.

  2. #32
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    That's funny, because the tip I gave for beginners was to do the opposite of what I have been doing and not panic and play over-aggressive. Maybe I should try taking my own advice haha

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterd View Post
    I'm a spike, and Thinking that spikes are motivated by EGO, is a misunderstanding of that kind of players. They thrive on TRYING TO WIN, games are problems with solutions, and the thrill is he research to finding the solution, if you hold yourself back you are not using your tools to solve the problem.
    We get motivated into getting with "arguments" with other people about the most efficient actions to solve a problem.Arguments are mostly resolved during the game.

    I would play etch and rune mages, except there is a consensus they make a worse game, that is "we don't want to play the game, AKA the problem that involves etch and rune mages". If there is a ENFORCED rule to ban etch and rune mages, spikes do not have a problem, but if they are ALLOWED, we consider it's part of the problem and just deyning ourselves the tool to solve the problem is nonsensical, if we do that, we are trying to solve a problem that is not the one present.

    Is like if Alice and Bob are arguing how to build the best bridge, and in his mind BOB want to limit itself in the use of steel. The conversation becomes pointless, it's ok though if BOB want to argue with CARL about how to build the best possible bridge without using steel.
    The rub, I think, is in what constitutes " the game" in an asymmetric game and/or deck construction game.

    I mean, I know with pretty high certainty that, even in tournaments, you don't always play the summoners with the very best odds of winning. You're showing at least some Johnny traits by challenging yourself to do well with a variety of summoners.

    At the other end, it's not like I ever find myself looking at a playable Magic Drain and thinking, "nah, it would be more exciting if I won without playing this OP card -- I think I'll just build it instead". That's madness. In-game, I try to maximize EV in wins.

    So the real issue seems to be how we view the middle ground, the deck construction. I tend to view it more like the choice of summoner, i.e. as a way to show my facility with variety of builds, each of which I'll try to play optimally once the game starts. This is how my inner Johnny emerges.

    I think it depends upon the details of the game in question. I may go more Johnny when building a SW deck in large part because I think it's usually very easy to see which is the star common, and which champions are best. You don't have to be a genius to see that Kynder, Lun and Gem Mages are going to win more games than Deep Troll and Miners. As I've been saying a bit lately, one of the great points of SW is that I can handicap myself against a weaker, or even brand new, player with my summoner and build, and then still put 100% of my effort into winning the game.

    I hasten to add, if these guys on the app were really such Spikes, why don't they step up their gameplay a bit? :-/

  4. #34
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    If i don't play the "best deck" is because the community has agreed it's the best deck, I play to "develop knowledge" of the game, I'm a gamer philosopher :P. If people already agree a deck is the best deck, I have no incentive to win with that deck anymore, but you may be right that may make me a non spike.
    I played Sera a lot in tournaments because i felt people were undevaluing SEra a lot. Interestingly after several tournaments I'm convinced the community was right. :P I often won tournaments with almost all factions but could never do so with sera, not ever once despite playing her like in A LOT of tournaments.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterd View Post
    If i don't play the "best deck" is because the community has agreed it's the best deck, I play to "develop knowledge" of the game, I'm a gamer philosopher :P. If people already agree a deck is the best deck, I have no incentive to win with that deck anymore, but you may be right that may make me a non spike.
    I played Sera a lot in tournaments because i felt people were undevaluing SEra a lot. Interestingly after several tournaments I'm convinced the community was right. :P I often won tournaments with almost all factions but could never do so with sera, not ever once despite playing her like in A LOT of tournaments.
    That sounds pretty close to my definition of a Johnny (and a description of myself), especially that the thing I'm usually trying to "prove" is not what the single best build is, but rather that many builds can win *more than people think* with best play.

  6. #36
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    More games with Waterd:

    4. SO v SG: Waterd was exposed early and Krusk took 5 damage before he managed to retreat. I rolled 0 for 3 3 times and failed to kill his blockers, who were all against vine walls. I should have won this one.

    5. CL v. SE: I spied Etch into the Discard pile. Waterd made a nice move when I sent up my 2 champs to cover off his starting wall - he basically "split them up" and placed a wall diagonal to his starting wall. It's not looking good. After picking off my two champs he summoned an RM and started draining me. I put either 5 or 7 dice on it to kill it. I had to expose Vlox to do that and he made short work of him.

    6. GD v BE: I summoned Thorkur to ping his wall. He made a nice move with his 3AV range champ and a mind witch to kill Thorkur in one turn. I killed his mind witch with Oldin but exposed him to a counter attack. waterd spent a lot of magic in order to keep Baldar back and I ended up getting gror out and doing some damage - I felt this one came down to rolls, it was pretty close. Etch came out late.
    Last edited by Rdebruys83; 07-04-2018 at 11:40 PM.

  7. #37
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    You are missing two games your CL vs my PE. and your PE vs MY GD

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterd View Post
    You are missing two games your CL vs my PE. and your PE vs MY GD
    Do you remember those ones? I'm drawing a blank.

  9. #39
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    Yes, your PE vs MY GD, you did kill etch wtih the combo of Burn greater burn, fire drake, but i used etch a few times, from there on it was a very normal game. I finished teh game with Gror going against your ellien.
    My thorkur fighted a ranged war with your holleas. I won tha tone.

    On your CL vs my PE, you did poke my ellien bu still with one wound, i still did hide ellien in A2, and used holleas to fend off a very agressive vlox into my territory. I used ellien Holleas combo to damage vlox and kill most units, you sent your admiral to fight my fire drake. A distinct moemetn in the game is where i didn't realize your scrapper was protected by admiral and i used Ellien to try to kill it, and then...yes admiral protected it, which allowed you a potential 3/3 win with scrapper into Vlox, but it failed, and the rest is history, I took that game.

  10. #40
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    I don't mind playing vs so with am all day. But I want to make clear that is well established that so with am is better than most decks with etch

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